In our Ask FGBC Anything video series, listeners submit questions that we then answer in a video format.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
old testament, promises, principle, psalm, israel, old covenant, scripture, god, deuteronomy, psalms, church, laws, text, exile, preach, book, life, good, christ, distinguish
SPEAKERS
Dr James Renihan, Dr Richard Barcellos, Pastor Jim Butler
Pastor Jim Butler 00:00
Uh, this is a good question. And I, I haven’t said that for all the questions, they’re all good questions. So you know, the the bulk of them are coming from our church. Again, I was trying to find a bit of solace. Well, you know, Mike’s church, Wim said they’re pretty much all our people. So I do want to communicate to our dear brethren. These are great questions. It is good stuff to think through. But this one in particular, I know it comes up quite a bit. Can I apply Old Testament promises to my life? Sometimes a verse is meaningful to me, although it seems that I took it out of context. And then there’s a particular example, Jeremiah, 29:11-13. That’s probably a text that’s been used at every Christian school graduation. I know the plans I have for you. That’s right, you’re going to be a success, Junior. And it was a letter to the exiles in Babylon. So I think that’s a really very good question.
Dr Richard Barcellos 01:07
Yeah, well, there’s a there’s a really broad and universal statement in Second Corinthians, chapter one, all the promises of God are yay and Amen in Christ Jesus. So I think that we have to distinguish promises, because he wouldn’t want to do the same thing with threats under the Old Covenant, can I personalize this threat? You know, make it my own threat? No. It was a historical event under a unique covenantal epoch with temporary purposes, that’s served its purpose. But even from those, if you read the confession carefully, and I think Scripture, you can gain, you know, principles from that, and Paul does that from Deuteronomy 25 and First Corinthians 9 and 1 Timothy 5, muzzling the ox and stuff. He draws a principle that you need to pay your pastor from that. So there are ways to do it. Some of the texts are, would be, you know, like that one. It does have, it was the people of God in exile. But somebody’s going to say, well, we’re in exile too, in one sense, yeah. So is there a principle there? Yeah, what is it probably not, what we usually make it, you know,
Pastor Jim Butler 02:27
you probably aren’t going to be an astronaut.
Dr Richard Barcellos 02:31
Yeah, we over inflate the promise and ourselves in light of the promise. So I don’t know if I have a really good answer for you, but some of these. That’s a good question. I mean, how do you take what it promises to ancient Israel and apply them to Christians now?
Pastor Jim Butler 02:48
I think it’s a good emphasis, though, to remember covenant. You know, if, oh, Israel is being chastised, I don’t think a young guy who may be struggling with a couple of sins, or, you know, things that are common. Can read Deuteronomy 28 and conclude he’s going to be exiled, he’s going to get, you know, reap disease and all those consequences. I mean, again, generally, you do bad things. God is a just judge. But we need to be cautious, not just in the application of those curses, but in the blessings as well. To take an old covenant promise unique to Israel, and this seems to happen a lot: apply them to America. Yeah, right. But whatever God said to Israel, and the old covenant is true of it, of America today.
Dr Richard Barcellos 03:36
What you just did is you distinguished covenantal epochs or eras, and you distinguish between moral and positive laws. So some of these threats and promises are very positive, very anchored, very connected to the time, tenure in the land.
Pastor Jim Butler 03:53
Yeah, right. So, yeah, anything else you want to add to that? No, okay, there’s not one text that you muse on often in the Old Testament that you take for yourself, yeah.
Dr Richard Barcellos 04:07
Can I just say one more thing? Sure, the first Timothy and First Corinthians. Use of Deuteronomy 25:4 is, is paradigmatic, I think. Okay, so you have these weird civil laws about animals. And Paul extracts a principle from that and says, Therefore, I think he’s saying this, Thou shalt not steal. Pay the man. You know what he’s worth. And so even in the positive laws that are fulfilled, there you can, if you dig deep enough, you can get a principle, a moral principle behind that that’s being applied in a specific redemptive historical context. That doesn’t entail to you know to this day, but the principle does. Yes. And that’s, that’s the hard work of, of,
Pastor Jim Butler 05:03
yeah, I think that’s where you know strategies like, well, whatever is true in judicial law, in the Old Testament, must be applicable to the USA that that’s an easier tactic on one level. It sounds very difficult thing to not actually do it, but the going through, because there is a connection between the Decalogue in chapter 20 of Exodus and then 21 to 23 these things were concrete applications in terms of their civil life. Yeah, that’s right. And there’s a lot of things there, like our confession says the general equity, whatever that means there’s something there for us to use, but it’s not a one for one transference, moving from Old Covenant to New Covenant, therefore. And it’s the therefores that I think, get us into a lot of trouble, and it does not take into consideration those redemptive movements in his country.
Dr Richard Barcellos 05:59
Yes, very excellent. Here’s something I’ve I share with students sometimes, I’m sure I’ve shared it from the pulpit as well. The nature, what is scripture? It’s written word of God. Scripture is organic because it’s from God. It’s all connected somehow, some way, it’s progressive. And this helps, hopefully, with answering this question. And it’s climactic. And the climax is not you and me. It’s not our problems, it’s it’s the Incarnation, sufferings and glory of Christ. That’s the big boom, the crescendo, you know, the drum roll, please, and the symbols are going Galatians 4:4: Why do we have a Bible to present the mediator of salvation for the glory of God. And if you take that with you, reading some of those things, you don’t read them as personal. You’re looking for something bigger, you know, that’s right. And I think we all need a dose of looking something bigger than looking for something bigger than yourself, that’s right. And the overall trajectory of what Scripture is revealing to us
Dr James Renihan 06:58
Not wanting in any way to deny what we’ve just said, because I wholeheartedly affirm it. But I think we also have to be careful that we don’t phrase ourselves in such a way that we remove the Old Testament from the Christian believer. Amen 100% you know, it was the only Bible of the apostolic age as the New Testament was being written when Paul writes his famous words about scripture in Second Timothy chapter three. First, he’s referring to the Old Testament, and then to the New added to the Old Testament. So the Old Testament is a Christian book, and it needs to be understood as a Christian book, but with a careful understanding of the progress of revelation and the progress of the covenants, and the difference between Old Covenant and New covenant, and how we understand those laws. So you know what put this into my mind is you asked me the question, is there an Old Testament text that you muse on. My answer actually would be, yeah, I hope so. When I sign my autograph in books, I have an Old Testament text that I always put there. It’s because the Psalms have become so important in my life, and I see Christ there, and I want those psalms not just to be nice, religious poetry that can soothe my heart, but I want to be able to see in them how they do relate to first Christ’s Church and then to me as a member of Christ Church. Yeah, that’s right. So, So Jeremiah 29:11 is the example I’ve used in lectures. I point that out to guys that we have to be really cautious in the way that we relate the testaments to each other. So let me go back to Mark 1:1, the beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ. There’s a change that comes with the appearance of John the Baptist. But still, the Old Testament is our book, and we need to see it as our book, use it and be strengthened in our lives and in our churches. I believe that as preachers, we ought to be preaching regularly from the Old Testament. So on, the Lord say morning, when I’m in Surrey, I’m going to preach on Psalm 15. And maybe I’ll preach from a psalm. Yeah, you’ve heard that one, yeah, maybe it’s sermon. Maybe I’ll preach a psalm for you guys on Sunday night, you know, because I want God’s people.
Pastor Jim Butler 09:26
And what the Jeremiah 29 passage, appreciating it in its context yields a wonderful view of our God. These people have been in captivity. You’re going to be freed from captivity for their sin, for your sin, you’re there. Yeah, I have plans. That’s right. This isn’t the end of the story, and just seeing it from that vantage point faithfulness. So everything ought to lead us back to an appreciation of God, right? Yeah. And I always think that’s a good practical application. This be a better you, or be a better this, or be a better that can. I just see my God and want to worship Him more? That, to me, is good, good application.
Dr James Renihan 10:05
It’s like the end of the book of Habakkuk. I think the same idea is there, though, everything falls apart. God is God, and trust in Him, amen. So I have, I have plans for you. I can look at that, and I can say that I know that the Lord has plans for me. It’s not the specific promise that Israel, but I can I know that He will glorify Himself and He will bring me safely to the end. Yeah, whatever trials I face in this life.
Pastor Jim Butler 10:28
Yes, absolutely. That’s the consistency that we we hold on to.
Dr Richard Barcellos 10:33
Jim said we should treat the Old Testament as Christian scripture. You know what? Augustine believed the first book of the New Testament was? Genesis, the Old Testament
Pastor Jim Butler 10:46
I agree 100%. So I’m not an autograph collector. So if I did ask you to autograph a book, what is the text?
Dr James Renihan 10:54
Psalm 73:25 and 26
Pastor Jim Butler
Oh good, which says “Who do I have in heaven but You?”. The NAS actually translates that beautifully.
Dr James Renihan 11:08
Whom have I in heaven, but You? And there is none upon earth that I desire besides you, my flesh and my heart fail, but God is the strength of my heart and my portion forever, which I think is so wonderful in Psalm 73 itself, because Asaph, that’s right, a leader among God’s people, until he went into the house. It’s such a great song. That’s wonderful, yeah, and the conclusion he he’s had his eyes down on Earth, that’s right, on other people. And when he finally looks up, he says, Oh, it makes sense. What have I done with my life? Exactly, you know, and who do I have.
Pastor Jim Butler 11:44
You’re going to preach that, right? That one, yeah, you can preach that
Dr James Renihan 11:48
great, great, great, so and, oh, there’s so much more. We can go it’s the first in the third book of the Psalms, right? Book Three Psalms, 73 begins. Book Three is the book Palmer Robertson calls it devastation, because it consistently reflects the trouble that has come upon Israel and the failure of the Davidic and Solomonic kingships preparing the way for the fourth book. What’s the first book? First psalm in the fourth book, it’s Psalm 90, a Psalm of Moses, the man of God, which speaks about God’s eternity. The Kings have failed. Israel is falling apart. All this is is true, but God is still God. And so the fourth book turns our eyes upwards. But this is not a discussion about the structure of the Psalms.
Pastor Jim Butler 12:35
Psalms are fantastic. Yeah, oh yes. It’s just a gift from our God to the people of God. Amen.
